ATTORNEYS LAW STUDENTS PUBLIC
TOP POSTS ALL POSTS SUBMIT POST
Share | Print | Report Post Privacy Law Chatboard
Click here

Re: Distance JD - Then "NOT" Taking the Bar
Posted by I got my ABA law degree on 9/07/08

    Post your law degree and I post mine.

    That was the challenge !

    On 9/07/08, Crown Prince wrote:
    > If you can't do paperwork for bankruptcy, then something is wrong with you.
    >
    > I never said I had a JD yet---I am a law student. Yes, go ahead and post your JD from Chicago. What is
    > your name so we can look it up on the state bar's website?
    >
    > Crown Prince
    >
    >
    > On 9/07/08, Don't Want to Take Bar Exam wrote:
    >> Go to LegalZoom.com, I believe Attorney Robert Shapiro is co-founder of LegalZoom.com. He is also one
    >> sharp lawyer. He approves of form fillers and legal document assistants and LegalZoom makes millions
    >> doing it. Remember Law can be a business as well as a vocation.
    >>
    >> I think telling someone you have an eJD is protected speech. 1st Amendment!!!
    >>
    >> It is not a crime to say you that you have a law degree, medical degree, engineering degree or basket
    >> weaving degree. But you must make it crystal clear when you are filling out the legal forms that you
    >> are not a member of the CA bar in good standing or a licensed lawyer, that you don't give legal
    >> advice. Having clients sign an ackknowledgement notice to this regard is very likely a good idea.
    >> Maybe a big classy sign posted behind you on the wall that states : "I am not an Attorney, just a
    >> legal documents Assistant or preparer, here to serve you."
    >>
    >> I say I'll will happily fill out legal forms, sell self-help books and run the documents to the court
    >> any day if I can build a multi-million dollar business like LegalZoom.
    >>
    >> As for unhappy clients wanting to get you in trouble with the bar for UPL or trying to put you out of
    >> the legal document business by tryng to get your LDP certificate revoke. I say every case is evaluated
    >> on its merits, if you did a good job, had safeguards in place and did not break the law, you (LDA)
    >> should be ok.
    >>
    >> Many lawyers get in trouble too. I know lawyers who get very upset when complaints are filed against
    >> them with the State Bar. Its not nice. Many of those complaints are frivolous and from clients who
    >> simply didn't like the results or outcome produced by the courts. Some clients don't want to pay the
    >> attorney his fee. Clients file frivolous complaints so that lawyers will stop collection actions. Many
    >> clients are "complaint happy".
    >>
    >> I disagree with Crown Prince, not any idiot can prepare a bankruptcy petition and forms. The legal
    >> document preparer must be competent to at least a minimum standard.
    >>
    >>
    >> Somebody posted here and said:
    >>>
    >>> "I am a licensed attorney, not a freakin document filler
    >>> and court runner like you."
    >>>
    >>> "You sure have alot of faith in your correspondence J.D. degree."
    >>
    >>
    >> CP said:
    >>
    >>>>>>>> "First and foremost, you are incorrect. I have included the statute below my posting. The
    >>>>>>>> bachelor's degree doesn't even have to be accredited. Don't believe me, read the statute.
    >>>>>>>> All I did was show the clerk (who could have cared less) a copy of my diploma. Didn't
    >>>>>>>> even have to show transcripts. "
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "Second, any idiot can do a bankruptcy. When I worked for a real estate attorney, he had a
    >>>>>>>> bankruptcy come in and asked if I wanted to do it. I told him sure. Got it done in a few
    >>>>>>>> hours. Typing in the figures on the typewriter took most of the time because he didn't
    >>>>>>>> have a bankruptcy software program. ANY IDIOT CAN DO IT. I have done wills, powers of
    >>>>>>>> attorney, trusts, and the like. I know LDAs who are also making over 100K a year."
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "EJDs are able to be conferred by the current state bar rules. Do you really want me to
    >>>>>>>> post another statute? Do your homework. It is also recognized. You just can't practice
    >>>>>>>> law with it. If it makes people feel better, why "
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "I think that you are just kinda angry that someone can legally do a bankruptcy or a will
    >>>>>>>> without having shelled out nearly 100K on an ABA law degree. "
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "The only thing worse is us dumb folk who are shelling out a total of $6000 for four years
    >>>>>>>> and a shot at the bar (Feb. 2011---I can't wait!). Stop being a hater. If you really did
    >>>>>>>> graduate from an ABA school, why are you wasting your time on this chatboard
    >>>>>>>> disseminating incorrect information and putting down people who are trying to make a
    >>>>>>>> difference or a buck in the legal profession. "
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> Get over it and get a job! You could have been halfway done with a bankruptcy already :)
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> Crown Prince
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "18. What are the educational requirements for registering? [Section 6402.1]
    >>>>>>>> To be eligible to apply for registration under this chapter as a legal document
    >>>>>>>> assistant, the applicant shall possess at least one of the following:
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> A high school diploma or general equivalency diploma, and either a minimum of two years
    >>>>>>>> of law-related experience under the supervision of a licensed attorney, or a minimum of
    >>>>>>>> two years experience, prior to January 1, 1999, providing self-help service.
    >>>>>>>> A baccalaureate degree in any field and either a minimum of one year law-related
    >>>>>>>> experience under the supervision of a licensed attorney, or a minimum of one year of
    >>>>>>>> experience, prior to January 1, 1999, providing self-help service.
    >>>>>>>> A certificate of completion from a paralegal program that is institutionally accredited
    >>>>>>>> but not approved by the American Bar Association, that requires successful completion of
    >>>>>>>> a minimum of 24 semester units, or the equivalent, in legal specialization courses.
    >>>>>>>> A certificate of completion from a paralegal program approved by the American Bar
    >>>>>>>> Association. "
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> Somebody on here said:
    >>
    >>>>>>>> On 9/06/08, I got an ABA degree wrote:
    >>>>>>>>> eJD "degree" does NOT meet any Legal Document License requirements whatsoever.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> An eJD degree is NOT recognized by any California Adminstrative or
    >>>>>>>>> licensing agency whatsoever ! period. end of discussion on that.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> It is and remains an oversold hyped oversold piece of paper with
    >>>>>>>>> no controlling legal authority.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> An earned J.D. degree that is bar qualifying however, is sanctioned
    >>>>>>>>> by statute and is legally authorized to be conferred by the new State
    >>>>>>>>> Bar rules.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> The J.D. is useless for legal document preparation.....law school
    >>>>>>>>> does not teach the practice of law or filling out of legal procedural
    >>>>>>>>> paperwork...In this case it is just another dreamer that wants so bad
    >>>>>>>>> to say, hey I have a law degree, or hey I have a J.D. degree let me
    >>>>>>>>> help you with your divorce, probate paperwork, restraining order or
    >>>>>>>>> help you fill out documents for the court. Its a joke....
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> I never learned anything in law school about filling out paperwork
    >>>>>>>>> and after I graduated I had to learn everything from lawyers who learned
    >>>>>>>>> from other lawyers...the hard humilating way.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> On 9/06/08, Crown Prince wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>> I agree with the spirit of what you posted. However, you are incorrect. Having a EJD
    >>>>>>>>>> can actually contribute to the necessary education required to become a LDA in any of
    >>>>>>>>>> California's counties. I know, because I am one. I didn't use an EJD (I had a
    >>>>>>>>>> regionally accredited BA and MPA to satisfy mine). Educational only, though.
    >>>>>>>>>> Experience is another issue. However, I do agree about hanging the JD on the wall---
    >>>>>>>>>> not a good idea--UPOL is definitely something to be leary of. All it takes is one
    >>>>>>>>>> client to pull the rug out from under you. One picture of that JD on the wall and you
    >>>>>>>>>> are history, perhaps behind bars...
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> By the way, as to the original poster, if you think you can make that much doing
    >>>>>>>>>> document preparation, even in a big city, you are bonkers. But hey, whatever floats
    >>>>>>>>>> your boat...
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> Crown Prince
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> On 9/06/08, I got an ABA degree wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>>> Better bone up on California law.
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> Legal Document Preparation requires meeting
    >>>>>>>>>>> specific educational requirements not a single
    >>>>>>>>>>> one which is met by a useless and worthless eJD degree.
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> The purpose of a JD degree is legal theory and doctrine
    >>>>>>>>>>> of contracts, torts, criminal procedure, constitional
    >>>>>>>>>>> law and a whole host of other subjects designed
    >>>>>>>>>>> to make one pass the bar exam by testing their
    >>>>>>>>>>> knowledge of legal theory and doctrine, none of which
    >>>>>>>>>>> in law school prepares one for the procedural paperwork aspect
    >>>>>>>>>>> of law. One is like being a Doctor and the other the Nurse.
    >>>>>>>>>>> In this case YOU would be the nurse and not the doctor so
    >>>>>>>>>>> a doctorate degree from an unaccredited law school would be
    >>>>>>>>>>> and is useless for a legal document preparer.
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> Dont waste your money on a eJD. You must take specific
    >>>>>>>>>>> paralegal document preparation courses to meet California
    >>>>>>>>>>> law.
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>> Telling someone you have a eJD degree while preparing their
    >>>>> restraining order or child custody hearing motion will mean
    >>>>> nothing and could constitute the practice of law if they perceive
    >>>>> you are telling them about your unaccredited eJD degree and how
    >>>>> and why that degree lets you help them fill out their document.
    >>>
    >>>>>>> Dont start a legal document preparation business and hang that
    >>>>>>> eJD degree anywhere near your "customers".....One mistake and
    >>>>>> the customer hires a real lawyer with a real J.D. degree and
    >>>>>> you will find out real fast how much trouble you really are in.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>>>> On 9/06/08, Don't Want Bar Exam wrote:
    >>>>>>> I just want to learn law in my DL eJD program and later become the best darn top
    >>>>>>> notch registered California Legal Document Assistant/Mediator/Notary Public. I'll
    >>>>>>> let the smart students become lawyers and do all the hard work, they can have all
    >>>>>>> the fame and glory. I just want to sell legal documents like divorces, wills,
    >>>>>>> LLCs, name changes, power of attorney and small claims documents, . I want to be
    >>>>>>> just like LegalZoom. But smaller and I don't need to be a multi-billion dollar
    >>>>>>> business, I'll settle for 2 or 3 million, I mean why be greedy.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>
    >>
    >>>>>>>On 9/06/08, Crown Prince wrote:
    >>
    >>>>>> I agree. Believe me, I tried to find loopholes to make it faster myself. There
    >>>>>>>are none. If you seriously think you can take the bar in any jurisdiction by
    >>>>>>>taking a non-bar track DL JD program, you also probably think Barack Obama
    >>>>>>>would make a good president.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>Do your research, contact your respective state bar(s), and post information if
    >>>>>>>it is relevant.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>I, unlike some of the other posters, don't mind the questions, as it allows us
    >>>>>>>to quash them and set people straight. Besides, they are always useful for a
    >>>>>>>good laugh...
    >>>>>>>Crown Prince

     
     

 
Google
 
Web Counsel.Net
  Site Map: Home Search Legal Jobs Classifieds Law Students Contacts Practice Areas Advertise
  © 1996 - 2008. All Rights Reserved. Please review our Terms of Use, Mission Statement, and Privacy Policy.